VT Stories Oral History with Kunmi Otitoju, April 22, 2016 (Ms2016-015)

AnnRea Fowler: Just tell me your name, date and place of birth.

Kunmi Otitoju: My name is Kunmi Otitoju. I was born in Lagos, Nigeria on the

12th of November, 1983.

AnnRea: What years did you attend Virginia Tech?

Kunmi: I was a master's student at Virginia Tech between 2005 and 2007, so I

started in August of 2005 and graduated in May 2007.

AnnRea: Tell me about where and how you were raised.

Kunmi: Oh, raised like up to what age?

AnnRea: Until you came to America.

Kunmi: 00:01:00Okay, where and how, you said?

AnnRea: With your family in Nigeria.

Kunmi: Okay. Well, I was born in 1983, and it was the middle of a military

regime. That wasn't so important then, but now it seems like it shaped a lot of

things that I didn't know at the time. But yeah. I was the second of five

children. And I don't know, I went to school in Nigeria like everyone else, like

nursery school, which I guess is like elementary school, until I was four, and

then primary school, which is like, I guess--no, it's elementary school,

sorry--from when I was five to when I was ten, and then high school from when I

was 11 to when I was like fifteen or sixteen. And high school was an all female

boarding school, so there's a whole lot of 00:02:00stories and things around that.

[Laughs]. Like finding someone to go to the prom with. But yeah, let me think. I

don't know if there's anything that significant about my childhood or my

upbringing. Like my parents just had regular jobs working with the ports

authority, the Nigerian ports authority, and then my dad kind of started his own

thing when I was about eight years old, I guess. But yeah. If you have any

specific questions of my childhood you can ask, but that's pretty much an overview.

AnnRea: What brought you to America?

Kunmi: To America? My sister was very smart, like is very, very smart, like

really good in math and science and stuff, so she would get the best grades in

national exams in Nigeria and things like 00:03:00that. And there was a professor from

Howard University in Washington, D.C. that was Nigerian and had a grant from

NASA to choose some really good students from Africa, in general, I think--I

don't think it was only Nigeria--for a NASA program, like exchange program or

something for a few weeks to a month. And my sister was one of them. And after

that my sister went to university in the States, Howard. And she didn't turn too

bad, so my dad figured that, you know, or my parents figured that they could

send their other kids to the States. 'Cause most people that were friends of my

dad and had a bit of money to send their kids abroad were sending their kids to

the U.K. because it's closer to Nigeria. And my dad really likes America, and

the whole freedom thing, and yeah. And he likes that you can get scholarships in 00:04:00America [Laughs]. So I took the SATs. I think I got like 1360 or 1350 out of

1600, which was the scale at the time. And my dad tells me look, this is the

scholarship scale for Howard, so if you take the exam again and get closer to

1600, you get a better scholarship. And I'm like look, I already have, you know,

they'll already be paying my tuition, housing, whatever. And he's like nope, I

think you should do it again. So when I graduated from high school, I joined a

SAT prep class and took the SATs again, and then I got a better score, like a

1400 or 1450 or something, and then my dad was happy. And then I went to the

States on a scholarship. And even then I was studying--well, I got in to study

electrical engineering, which was what my parents wanted--more my dad. He just

wanted all his kids to be engineers. Pretty 00:05:00typical Nigerian thought or

mentality, like you want your kids to be engineers, or lawyers, or doctors, and

everything else is kind of what you do for a living, you know. Yeah, but when I

got into Howard, or even before I was at Howard, I was taking some computer

science classes and programming classes. I just really liked computer science.

So when I got into Howard, I took a computer science class in the first

semester. I really liked it, so I switched to computer science, and that's what

I studied at Howard, and after that at [Virginia] Tech.

AnnRea: After going to Howard University, how did you choose Virginia Tech?

Let's see if I can turn the volume down.

Kunmi: Okay, sorry, I am very close.

AnnRea: It's fine. It's good because it matters that it goes in there.

Kunmi: Okay. Between my accent and the 00:06:00volume, you'll have to figure out. Can

you hear what I'm saying?

AnnRea: Yeah.

Kunmi: Okay, good. So what was the question?

AnnRea: How did you choose Virginia Tech?

Kunmi: Okay. So I think Virginia Tech kind of chose me [Laughs]. 'Cause I really

didn't want to come. It's really silly, and it sounds a bit--really sounds a bit

arrogant, but I just didn't want to come to [Virginia] Tech. I like computer

science, but I really, really liked animation and filmmaking and stuff. And I

had got into University of Southern California, which has a very good animation

program. I got into their animation program for grad school, and then into Johns

Hopkins' computer graphics program, which is totally different from animation,

but I didn't know at the time. I was just like ah, you know, it looks like it

might have 00:07:00animation. And then [Virginia] Tech had at least one animation class

that was in the works, but not an animation program. The closest they had was

maybe human computer interaction and some computer vision. And I had applied to

[Virginia] Tech because I think I applied to [Virginia] Tech for undergrad and

got in as well. There was just something about [Virginia] Tech that I liked, but

I don't know, at that time I really wanted to study animation and be somewhere

like California where there was a film scene, I guess. But then I got in, and

then weeks after I got my acceptance letter, I think I also got an invitation or

like something asking if I still wanted a teaching assistant position. And of

course my parents are not really rich or anything, so any help is super 00:08:00 welcome.

And they were like would I like to come and see the campus and talk with the

professors and all that. And at this time I was getting pretty much nothing from

all the other schools. Like USC, that's Southern California, was offering me

$2,000 out of like a $30,000 tuition, and I was just like, ah! [Laughs] Where

was the rest of the 28,000 going to come from? So I hid the letter from my dad

for some days. Really not a long time. Maybe less than a week. He was like, so

have you heard from Virginia Tech? No, not really. I mean, they accepted me, but

not really, you know, I don't know if I have anything from them. But then in the

end I had to tell him, so I was like, yeah, Virginia Tech might be offering me

like a teaching assistantship. And he was like, have you accepted? I hope you

said yes. And it was just like I knew this was gonna happen [Laughs]. But then I

came to Blacksburg and I just fell in love with the 00:09:00campus. I was like, no! I

like it [Laughs]. And yeah, and that was pretty much that. I mean, it was kind

of decided for me because, you know, tuition is one of the key deciding factors.

So-- And then I loved the campus and drill field and the stone of the buildings.

It was just really nice. And everyone was welcoming, and they seemed like they

wanted me here. Like the other schools, they just like fired some letters and

some, you know, brochures or whatever from time to time, but there wasn't any--

Like when I came to [Virginia] Tech, there was Jamika, for instance. There was a

whole day scheduled for me, like okay, at this time you meet this professor,

talk with them about your interests, at this time you have lunch with this

person, they show you around campus. So it was really like whoa, this is, you

know, like I felt kind of good, special, 00:10:00whatever. And that was nice. I felt

like okay, even if Blacksburg is not exactly easily accessible for my parents or

family or whatever, I would feel at home here. And that made it easy to accept.

And I don't know, I like orange and maroon together. So yeah, that made it

easier to accept.

AnnRea: In your handbags and the things that you design, are there any maroon

and orange colored things?

Kunmi: Yeah there are. And I've actually made a few bags for people in

Blacksburg. And they say, okay, I want this blue bag, but I want it in orange

and maroon. Oh yeah, I can do that.

AnnRea: The first time you came to Virginia Tech, what did it feel like being on

campus and what did it look like? Were there any major changes, 00:11:00buildings that

weren't there? What did it smell like?

Kunmi: Okay, you mean when I came as a student or when I came to visit?

AnnRea: Just the first time you stepped on campus.

Kunmi: Okay, say the question again.

AnnRea: What did it feel like, smell like, look like?

Kunmi: Okay, I'm going to have to think of this one. I mean, the first thing is

the maple trees, no? I think I immediately liked Virginia because of that. They

are maple trees, right? That turn like orange and maroon in the autumn. That

wasn't immediately, because I got here in August and I think the trees really

change color like ending of September, October or something like that. But still

it is really a huge--you know, it's really a huge sensory thing. You wake up and

it's just beautiful. Let me see the question 00:12:00 again.

AnnRea: What's your first memory of Virginia Tech the first time you stepped on campus?

Kunmi: Okay, let me think.

AnnRea: It can even be something bad. Like if it was cold that day and you're

like, oh, the weather is awful.

Kunmi: Yeah, no, I didn't even think it was cold. Let me think. I don't

remember, really. I remember my general impressions. For example, I was staying

at, I think it was, Main Campbell. Sometimes I mix it up and say East Campbell.

But Main Campbell, not the ground floor, but the upper floor was for

international students and students that were in undergrad or grad school, maybe

doing an exchange program or whatever. And that was really cool. Like my friends

were like French, Icelandic, German, Italian, and we would just do everything

together, 'cause there was a bit more of a group culture. I don't know if it's a

European thing or it's just because they put us all together on that floor. But

we would all go to the club on the weekend, or we'd all go to have lunch or, you

know, it was just really cool. We'd organize group trips to New York 00:13:00City or

whatever. And many of them are still my friends now, like we're still really in

touch, or when they come into Spain they come and see me, and yeah, we just

catch up and hang out. So I think becoming part of that type of community so

quickly and so unexpectedly in a place like Blacksburg, I think that was one of

the main things that kind of shaped my idea of Blacksburg as a place that I

liked or that felt like home. But like sensory, I'm just going to have to say

the trees, and the colors, and the drill field, and being able to sit in such a

huge open space. Because my undergrad was at Howard University, and it's right

in the middle of D.C., northwest. There isn't a lot of space for stuff, you

know, like to have a Drillfield 00:14:00[Laughs]. So being able to just, after class, or

before class, like sit down under a tree and lie down if you want, look up, it

was like--it was really nice. And it was nice that I could be close to nature,

because I've always lived in a city or grown up in a city and just not had a lot

of space for that.

AnnRea: When you were talking about the trees in the fall, it makes me think of

the one thing that everybody thinks about, football games. Did you go to any

football games, and how did those feel? I'm sure it was a different experience

than anyone has ever had, if they haven't been to a [Virginia] Tech game, so how

did that feel for you?

Kunmi: It was nice. Well, the first thing is you really have to like Hokie

colors to even be on this campus at all. If not you'll just like, I don't know,

not enjoy yourself. But yeah, the 00:15:00spirit and the energy is unique to college

football, really. And I think we were doing a bit better in football than we--

yeah. I think, you know, it was just exciting and nice to go to games. Tell me

something again. Give me some direction. What do you want to know?

AnnRea: Were you a big football fan or did this make you a football fan because

of the spirit and the energy?

Kunmi: Yeah, it made me a football fan. Right now I'm not a big football fan.

I'm more a Formula One fan. But yeah, like all of us going to the game together

dressed in orange or maroon, or orange and maroon or, you know, like--was

definitely something to look forward to. And then even trying to get a ticket,

which wasn't automatic. Yeah, it was more like the feeling, you 00:16:00know, like I

don't know if I stayed from beginning to end for a lot of games, but just the

feeling of being on Lane Stadium and with your friends, and sometimes at night,

you know. Yeah. It was just part of the life here.

Q: What mentors or advisors did you have here that were particularly helpful or

influential? It can even be some advisors since then.

Kunmi: Okay. Well, my thesis advisor was pretty awesome from the beginning, from

before I even enrolled at [Virginia] Tech until graduation and after. And he's

Steve Harrison in the computer science department. Yeah, so I was like yeah, I

want to do animation and blah, you know, stuff like that when I first came 00:17:00 in.

And he was like--you know, he would just know the right questions to ask and

kind of gently tell me yeah, maybe, you know, we have something similar, but

it's not exact, like just help me see what was possible with what was here at

[Virginia] Tech, and how that could fit into what I wanted. And yeah, that was

cool. I think at [Virginia] Tech I learned a different type of thinking or a

different type of way of seeing things or solving challenges or whatever. And a

lot of it was attributed to working with Steve Harrison and doing my thesis with

him because I wrote a thesis and he was my advisor for it. He also taught a

cyber arts class that I was a TA for, along with--it was an interdisciplinary

class. So it was perfect for me because I like 00:18:00art. I like music, but I don't

really play any musical instrument. I like computer science and some math or

whatever. And this interdisciplinary class had professors from the art

department, and the music department, and in computer science, and brought

students together. Like we had a student that was a biology undergrad. And we

all had to come together with our different skills or whatever. We had an

industrial design student at some point. We all had to come together, and were

given projects, and we had to build something, usually. And that was nice, and

just like expansive thinking. I think when you come from a country like Nigeria,

where it's like okay, what do you study? Computer science. Okay, you know,

you're pigeonholed into this thing, and you can't try to be anything different

from that. A lot of schools in Europe are like that, 00:19:00too, I think. It's like,

you know, okay, so you studied math; why are you trying to do art? But that's

not how problems are solved. Like you need an interdisciplinary approach for, I

think, some of the really good solutions to problems that we have today. It

can't just be ten mechanical engineers working together. And [Virginia] Tech was

nice because that was very natural in at least my coursework. It was very, you

know, oh, you want to take a French class? Okay, that's cool. You can take a

French class. I have space for you. Or you want to take an art history class?

Yeah, that's nice. I could do that in my undergrad, but in [Virginia] Tech it

just--I don't know, it seemed more natural for teachers to understand or see, or

let you do that.

AnnRea: So what are some of your favorite memories or experiences from your time

at Virginia 00:20:00 Tech?

Kunmi: Okay, let me think. I was writing memories before we started that I

already talked about. Repetition is boring. So let me think of some more. Okay,

one of my friends I'm actually going to see tomorrow, Brian, we used to go on

the, what's it called, the bike path? The path. The path. There is a path. I

don't remember what it's called. It's just a bike path, really. But like I had a

bike, and he had a bike, and we just used to ride down to wherever. I would get

tired very easily, so we only did like-- and it's not a very long path, I think.

But that was nice because, I don't know, I just liked it. And then I was in the

salsa club here, and I was actually the web designer of the salsa club for like

a 00:21:00year. And yeah, salsa students are special. There was this guy, also called

Brian, he was a chemistry Ph.D. student, and he was our teacher, our salsa

instructor. And yeah, we were all just addicted, like salsa addicts. Actually,

that was a big part of my life at [Virginia] Tech. Because you would be like in

your apartment later, doing your homework, and just like dancing in your seat,

or like-- like we were always dancing, or thinking of dancing or whatever. And

we had classes on, I think, Monday nights, and then salsa dancing on Wednesday

and some other nights of the week, maybe Thursday. Was it Wednesday nights?

Yeah, because I remember Thursday classes used to suffer [Laughs]. I'd be like

really sleepy because I'd been dancing salsa the night before. And yeah, that

was a big part of life at [Virginia] Tech. And yeah, April 16, actually, one of

the dancers 00:22:00passed. And another guy that had come to salsa, but I think nobody

really knew him, but I knew 'cause I had danced with him. But yeah. So yeah,

salsa was a big, big, big memory from [Virginia] Tech. [Virginia] Tech is where

I learned how to dance salsa, and I've been dancing since then, so it's almost

ten years.

AnnRea: What difficult experiences did you have and how did those affect your

life now?

Kunmi: Okay. I think writing my master's thesis was difficult. Just because it's

so self-directed. And because there's a fear of not finishing it before the

deadline. Yeah, so that was 00:23:00difficult. But just while I was turning in stuff

before deadlines and whatever, the really difficult thing happened, which was

April 16th, the shooting. Yeah, and--yeah, that was difficult. Do I have to talk

about it? Should I talk about it?

AnnRea: If you want to.

Kunmi: Okay. So what's the question?

AnnRea: Just what difficult experiences did you have and how do those affect you today?

AnnRea: Okay. I think for most people that were on campus or associated with

[Virginia] Tech somehow in 2007, when the shooting happened, I think that was

quite easily the most difficult thing that we had to deal with. And after

[Virginia] Tech I had years of just, you know, not-- I don't know, years of not

being, I don't know, not 00:24:00trusting people so much because who knows what's gonna

happen if you're the only person in a movie theater, and some crazy person walks

in, or-- And the most frustrating thing was that I was following over like

[airports] to change legislation on, you know, to change gun laws and stuff. And

even after something so horrible, nothing was happening. Nobody was saying--

Nobody was coming up with anything creative enough to control, you know, gun

possession by people that might just use them the wrong way, you know? That was

very frustrating. Let me think. So how did it shape me after? Okay. So Paul

Torgersen, that's the guy, he passed like last 00:25:00year, I think, but he was

formerly president of Virginia Tech, and he, I think, was also head of the

Engineering Department. Not while I was at [Virginia] Tech. I think he had

retired before I joined [Virginia] Tech, but he was still quite active at

[Virginia] Tech. And when the shootings happened, he spoke with us and I think

he just met with some engineering students in maybe some basketball courts on

campus or something, and he was telling us, you know, that when something like

this happens, then you have to kind of decide to live your life for two,

something like that, like you're no longer living just your life, but you are

also carrying along the life of the person that you lost. He wasn't necessarily

just saying in this shooting, but if someone loses their mom, or someone loses

someone they really love. I think especially in this, 'cause everyone was still

so young and had their dreams or had all the energy 00:26:00to potentially do things

that never came to pass. And it was a really hard time for me personally because

it didn't make any sense what had happened, of course, and because in that

senselessness I was trying to find some rationale or some--yeah, I was trying to

find some rationale. Like of course find some meaning out of the senselessness,

which is a very trite thing to say, but it was really important for me to just

have something I could hold onto, like okay, this happened, this is the good

that can come out of it, or this is why it may have been good that it happened,

which still makes no sense. But still just something to hold onto every day, you

know, besides just like devastating pain and sadness. And yeah, that really gave

me hope, like yeah, you know, like I 00:27:00can do something where I am--where I feel

like okay, Lauren is the person I really know that passed, Lauren McCain. And it

just felt like it would be easier to carry her along, or to just keep her memory

alive by doing something different or not living my life in a regular way,

whatever that meant. And I just always had that in my mind, like, you know, I

just didn't want to live a regular life or do anything where I didn't feel I

would be giving my best. So like after [Virginia] Tech I had a job in consulting

in Northern Virginia, in Arlington, with a consulting company. It was really

nice. And after a while I just felt-- first I felt bored and second I felt like

I was just, I could be doing 00:28:00ten times more than what I was doing sitting at my

desk eight hours a day. And I don't know if I already had a personality where

that situation would have made me change course of career or whatever anyway,

but just having been through April 16 and all that pain, and knowing that the

fact that you're young doesn't mean that you have fifty years more, or sixty to

figure stuff out or make your life meaningful, that was enough for me to just

take action and change my life to be more of what I wanted it to be. And I know

many people--I knew some people then that were just like oh, I don't like my

job, but going to work every day for two or three more years before they did

something about it, and for me that wasn't an option. And I think now everything

has normalized to the point that it feels like almost normal the way I am. 00:29:00But I

think I did feel like a conscious thing then where it was like I could tie cause

and effect, like I could say April 16, there was before and there was after. And

after I didn't want to waste life or waste time or do things that were

unsatisfying, or that didn't make me smile, or happy, or hang around people that

didn't make me feel alive or yeah, I don't know. I also live in Barcelona, so I

am a bit of a hippie [Laughs]. But yeah, you're just more practical about life

and what you want out of it, I think. Was that a very long answer?

AnnRea: That was a good answer. What was life like at [Virginia] Tech the first

year. You said you have a lot of international friends because you were on the

same floor, but what about your 00:30:00classes and figuring out what you wanted to-- So

what exactly-- You did computer science here?

Kunmi: Yes.

AnnRea: I wasn't sure because you were talking about animation at other places,

but [Virginia] Tech didn't have an animation program yet. So tell me about your classes.

Kunmi: Oh, my classes, okay. Yeah, first most of my teachers were really good.

So yeah, I think [Virginia] Tech is a university that has really good

professors. I hope it's still that way. I'm sure it's still that way. But it's

just, you know, you really feel like whoa, okay, I have to really buckle up

because this teacher is awesome. And so my classes--I studied human computer

interaction. It's in the computer science department. And 00:31:00there's a human

computer interaction, like what's it called? VTHCI, I think, VTCHI. I don't

know. I don't remember. Center for Computer Human Interaction, I think. So my

first year was really just classes and trying to figure out what a thesis topic

might be. My second year was spending more time doing research and going to the

center more and getting subjects, interviewing them like you're interviewing me

now, and coming up with a thesis idea, kind of building it, getting the IRB

forms approved, blah, you know. That was more second year. So--tell me the

question again.

AnnRea: Just classes 00:32:00your first year. And you just went into your second year.

So second year was thesis and that stuff.

Kunmi: Yeah, and first year I was a TA for--well, at least first semester of

first year I was a teaching assistant for like, I think, Intro to Programming

with Dwight Barnette. And so I think lab was once or twice a week. So I would

wake up, go to--now was it Norris or--I think my office was in McBryde and the

classes were in McBryde. So I would just go to McBryde and help students with

their lab work, and then have office hours. And that was nice, too, because the

other grad students that had office hours with me, we'd just be there waiting

for students to come and ask us questions or need our help or something, and in

between the waiting time we'd be doing our homework or sharing funny--not really

memes then, but 00:33:00like, I don't know, animated things to pass your time or just

stuff like that. And that was fun. But yeah, my classes, I don't know, what can

I say about my classes? They were classes. I had to do them. That was why I was

here. But yeah, my teachers were really good, my classmates were really smart,

and--and yeah. Anything else you're going to have to be more specific.

AnnRea: Were there any particular classes that you really enjoyed? Did you take

any fun classes?

Kunmi: Okay. Let me think of my classes. So in first year, I think it was in the

first semester, I took Intro to Usability Engineering, and it was a totally new

field to me, really, even though I was studying human computer interaction, so

of course you would think I would know 00:34:00what usability engineering was or

whatever. But my undergrad in Nigeria, computer science was still programming or

like database management or maybe web design or computer security. It

wasn't--like usability engineering and human computer interaction in general are

fields that are just more--they're more inclusive. You're saying yeah, computers

are cool, but we don't want them to be just for geeks or just for people who

know how to program. Like here, welcome, we're making everything nicer for you.

And being in that type of field was pretty cool and was pretty new for me. I

think I already had something in me that knew how to think in terms of creating

something for other people to use, but studying human computer interaction, or

majoring in, you know, like focusing on that in computer science made 00:35:00me think

differently. It was a whole shift, change. It wasn't like okay, I'm gonna

program this as my homework. It was like okay, if I had this user and they had

this disability, or if I had this user and they were this age or they had this

interest, how would I create this interface, or how would I, you know. The cave

was also really cool. Like there's a VT cave. It's like an immersive virtual

environment. I think it was in Torgersen. I don't know where it is now. But we

had a four wall cave so you could pretty much go in there and be like, almost

like you were in a 3D environment. Yeah, you were in a 3D environment. And it

was pretty cool the things we could do in there. And we ended up publishing two

papers also on research that we came up with in the cave because we had an

excellent virtual environment professor called Doug Bowman, Dr. 00:36:00Bowman. I think

he's now at Apple or something. So yeah, you just felt like you were in the

midst of awesome people and technology, and it was up to you to make something

of it.

AnnRea: How has your Virginia Tech education played out in your life? You

mentioned you already wanted to--or you already had something as a part of you

that wanted to make it more available for people who didn't know how to use it

as much. So has that really played out in your life now in what you do?

Kunmi: Yeah. So--well, first I have an irrational love for orange and maroon,

which hasn't happened for the colors of my undergrad university, so I think

there was definitely something in the 00:37:00water at-- Sorry, that was very silly

[Laughs]. Tell me the question again. How has my Virginia Tech education--?

AnnRea: How has it affected your life now? Or how do you use it?

Kunmi: I don't know. I think it's hard to say. I think after a long time it's

just like--I don't know, everything has come together. It's like I don't know

how being raised in a country that was under military rule for my first

fourteen, fifteen years, how that has affected me. After a while it just is

something that, you know, I can't isolate so much all the influences. But in

general, let me think of a few things in my life that I have been impacted 00:38:00by. I

don't know. I think it was the place where I learned what design was in general,

and where I learned-- Where I learned how cool interdisciplinary work was. So

now I'm always excited to work with people from other backgrounds or fields or

whatever because I just know that there's a richness in what everybody will

bring to the table to solve problems. And maybe that's more in a work type of

way. But 00:39:00yeah, I think definitely it was at [Virginia] Tech that I just like

learned what design was and--yeah, I already said all that before. I can't

really think of anything that I can say now, you know, like okay, this was my

Virginia Tech education. I think also it being a small town, Blacksburg, and

people just being so cool. Like I don't know, I just met the nicest people here.

I really did. And of course you carry that with you everywhere. Once you see how

nice life is when almost everyone is really nice without expecting anything, and

then you go to some places and it's not always like that. But then you just have

to decide how you will be. And it's easier to be a nice or good way if you

already have seen how nice it is to be surrounded by nice 00:40:00people. Now I'm just

getting silly. But no, really, I think, you know, that's major for me. Like

there are some places I've moved to--I've moved around quite a bit. I've worked

in-- well, I've been on internship in Norway, I've done a study abroad in Paris,

I live in Barcelona now. I've lived in Barcelona for the past six and a half

years. After [Virginia] Tech I moved to Arlington, Virginia to work. Before

[Virginia] Tech I was in Washington, D.C. I was raised in Lagos, Nigeria. I

spent two months in Italy. So I've moved around quite a bit and just people do,

you know, good behavior is different in different cities. And it's nice when you

have some really good experiences so that even when you're in a city where good

behavior is not that cool, you can still consciously decide how you want to be.

And usually that's a better way than the other people are.

AnnRea: If someone said the words Virginia Tech, what is the first 00:41:00thing that

pops into your mind?

Kunmi: I mean, the most obvious things is the colors for me. But that's also

maybe 'cause I work in such a-- Like now I make things, so I'm always thinking

in terms of colors and combinations of colors and textures and stuff. And yeah,

one of the most defining things about [Virginia] Tech is the hokey colors, I

think. And the textures of the stone. Though over the years I kind of thought

about Hokie stone, even though I liked it so much when I first moved here. What

was the question?

AnnRea: Just the first thing you think of when someone says, Virginia Tech.

Kunmi: Okay, I already said two. I think Blacksburg. That's what I think.

AnnRea: Are you still involved with Virginia Tech in any way?

Kunmi: Let me think. I'm still in touch with 00:42:00my advisor and I'm still in touch

with--okay, so Virginia Tech had this really cool thing called like a welcome

program, like a Virginia Tech friendship program. And they paired up new

students, new international students, with a host family. So you didn't live

with your host family, but they invited you to basketball games, or they invited

you and your friends over for lunch, whatever, you know. And I had, I think, an

unusually successful pairing with my host parents. So Debbie Day, who works for

the Alumni Association here at [Virginia] Tech, and J.S. Brown and their family.

And I'm staying with them now while I'm at [Virginia] Tech. But yeah, they come

to pretty much see me in Barcelona. They've been twice. And they are one of the

main reasons that it's easy for me to come back to [Virginia] Tech after what,

like seven--? No, more than seven. Goodness 00:43:00me, I'm old. After like-- oh, shit,

how many years has it been? Like nine years. After nine years, you know, they

are still like a good link. When I lived in the States I used to receive more

alumni emails. I think that's just something I need to update so that yes, I can

start to think seriously about giving back to the university and stuff like that.

AnnRea: What changes have you seen at Virginia Tech over time and what do you

think about those changes?

Kunmi: Oh, you have to help me with the name of the arts--there's an arts center.

AnnRea: The [Moss] Arts Center.

Kunmi: Yeah, that's new, no? So when I was on campus in 2014, I think, maybe it

was super, super new then, and yeah, it was nice to see that. Because if we had

something like that when I was studying cyber arts, I think it would have been a

nice place for us to exhibit 00:44:00some of the projects we were working on that were

interdisciplinary, combining animation, music, and what else, maybe art. Yeah,

it would have been a nice place to show those. So yeah, that. But really, let me

think. I haven't spent enough time on campus to really see the changes. I do get

told, but if I don't see what the changes are myself, I don't really know. But

it still seems like a pretty campus, and I think that every new building would

have a purpose, because I just trust that that's how the school would choose to develop.

AnnRea: Are there any changes that you would like to see, either in academic

programs or campus?

Kunmi: No, I don't know. I can't really 00:45:00 tell.

AnnRea: There actually is a new cadet dorm. I don't know if you were on the side

of Squires that the buses are.

Kunmi: Okay, yeah. Well--

AnnRea: And it's the huge building across.

Kunmi: Oh, I need to see that, okay.

AnnRea: It's gorgeous.

Kunmi: What is it called? I'll check.

AnnRea: I know the names of almost all the buildings, but I don't know what that

one is.

Kunmi: Okay, I mean, speaking about what I think about from time to time of

[Virginia] Tech, in West AJ, was it? What's the awesome food court or dining hall?

AnnRea: Oh the West End.

Kunmi: Yeah, West End, yeah. West End was really good.

AnnRea: I actually live in West AJ.

Kunmi: Oh yeah? Lucky you.

AnnRea: So I'm always going to West End.

Kunmi: Yeah, yeah, that was like really good. I mean, they pretty much redefined

for me what campus food could be.

AnnRea: What would you like 00:46:00people to know about you?

Kunmi: Oh jeez, I don't know. What is interesting for you to know about me?

AnnRea: Well, let's just talk about what you do now. So you're a designer.

Kunmi: Yeah.

AnnRea: And how do you-- like do you run your own website?

Kunmi: Yeah.

AnnRea: That's so awesome. You're just like a jack of all trades. So how did you

get started making handbags and different accessories?

Kunmi: Yeah. Well, yeah, I mentioned that thing before about how it was so cool

for me to find an interdisciplinary program at [Virginia] Tech, or find people

that thought in that way because I'm really good at writing and creative

composition or whatever, really good at math. I was. I don't know now. But yeah,

you 00:47:00know. And really good at--well, then the most obvious thing was drawing and

painting and stuff. Like in high school I'll win the art prize every year,

sometimes win the English prize. The math prize, like there were many people who

were very good at math, so it's always harder. But yeah, I would represent the

school in mathematics competitions and win. That was high school in Nigeria. And

that was reflected in exams I took after and all that. So I really didn't know

what I wanted to do because there are so many things that I like and could do.

But then after working for a bit as an information architect and usability

specialist, I really wanted to start making things with my hands and just doing

something where I could use art a bit more. And that took me to school in

Barcelona. And there I learned 00:48:00metalwork, woodwork, and just how to use tools,

metalwork tools and woodwork tools. When I finished, it wasn't practical for me

to set up a metalwork or woodwork workshop because of space constraints, and

it's very noisy work so you can't just do it in your apartment in one spare room

or anything like that. And then I started looking at other things I could do,

and so I just came up with leather somehow, like leatherwork. At the same time

I'd also been collecting these aso-oke fabrics from my mom's closets, because

she has like--or she had, if I took them all--she had lots and lots of this

fabric. This is fabric that is hand woven in the southwestern part of Nigeria,

and a lot of it is also woven in Ghana, but usually for Nigerian consumption.

It's made on really narrow looms that are like, let me 00:49:00say, maybe five inches

wide, four to five inches wide, and then the strips--it's sold in strips, and

those strips are sewn together to make flowing outfits or head ties or whatever

that are used for ceremonies, wandering ceremonies in southwestern Nigeria.

That's where I'm from. I'm Yoruba. My family is from Ekiti State in Nigeria.

Yeah, so the thing is after those ceremonies people don't really wear those

fabrics anymore because they're impractical. They're really dense. They're made

from really dense cotton. And because it's hand woven. I think with all the high

tech weaving technology now you can come up with really finely woven cotton or

wool outfits, no? But when you're hand weaving something, it's just like raw and

rough. And this in 00:50:00particular, at least, it comes out quite dense. And Nigeria

is really hot, so nobody wants to wear that to work or whatever. So most times

it just ends up in people's closets. Also because it's like a group wear thing,

so if someone is having a ceremony like a wedding or a naming ceremony, they

decide what fabric, what particular weave or what particular design and colors

of aso-oke they want to have and then they sell bales, like a few rolls of that

to their friends that are coming to that evens. So everyone shows up that day

dressed the same. So you're not picking the fabric. The person who picks the

fabric is the person who hosts the event. So most likely afterwards, if you

didn't like it, if you only wore it for that group 00:51:00event, after that you most

likely wouldn't wear it anymore, right? It's just in your closet. So many people

have clothing that they don't use in their closets made of this really cool

fabric. And I've liked aso-oke since I was much younger. And when I was leaving

home and going to university in the States and stuff, I would just take it with

me and always think of what I could do with it. But then with Minku I think that

came together because I found a way to repurpose the fabric in a way that

could--that not only I would enjoy, but I could, I don't know, share it with

people and get to tell them about my culture somehow, even though I was far away

from home. And yeah, that was nice.

AnnRea: What would you like people to know about Virginia Tech?

Kunmi: About [Virginia] 00:52:00Tech? Oh. I think I already said, in a way, many of the

things I would like people to know about [Virginia] Tech. I don't know. That

it's home for me. It's one of my homes. Even though I don't look like it might

be home. And yeah, that it's beautiful. And that community is important here.

Like in a real sense, I think. At least it was for me. I mean, I can't project

my experience on everyone. But it felt like me and my friends and-- I mean,

after almost ten years we are still in touch. It's important to them to see me

when they come to Barcelona, which is where I live now. It's just like within

two years you just build these ties that are still real and active many years 00:53:00later. And yeah, it's a place that I think has high potential happening.

AnnRea: What things do people not know, including negative or difficult things,

about [Virginia] Tech that would be helpful to talk about?

Kunmi: Oh. Let me think. I guess now I have to think about negative things. Let

me see. I mean, I do read about-- I didn't experience this that I can remember,

but I also don't have feelers out for it, so it's hard for me to know, but I do

read and I know that acceptance of people from 00:54:00other--I don't know, people who

look different, people from other races has been, in the past, a problem at

[Virginia] Tech, including just right before I joined, I think, there was some

event in Squires with maybe some defacing of some cultural center. There are

events like that. I mean, it is a place with people from all over the U.S., and

increasingly all over the world, and people come sometimes with their prejudices

or their ideas. And yeah, that is real and happens at [Virginia] Tech. Really I

can't give any firsthand experience of it, but I know that I have read things

about 00:55:00it. Let me see. I don't know. Let me think. Yeah, no, I don't really have

any negative memories of [Virginia] Tech, and I don't want to think about it

now. I don't want to force any out of my subconscious or wherever. But yeah, no.

Yeah. I think that's the closest I can come.

AnnRea: Is there anything I haven't asked you that you thought I would ask or

that you would like to talk about?

Kunmi: I had no expectations. I think I just got the email two days ago, so like

trying to make it to Blacksburg from New York. It's been a good interview so

far, I think. Let me think. What did I think you might ask me? I don't know. I

do want to ask you how [Virginia] Tech is now, or what it is for you now, or I

don't know. Do you live on campus?

AnnRea: Mm-hmm. I live in West AJ. And I'm a 00:56:00freshman. So some of the things

that you're mentioning I'm like I have no idea, because I'm still halfway lost

around here.

Kunmi: So you started just like in August, so--yeah, okay. Nice.

AnnRea: I think it's great now. I'm an English major and I just added a business minor.

Kunmi: And what's your course load like? What has it been like? How many hours

do you have to take?

AnnRea: I've just been taking fifteen a semester. And I took a three credit

class in the winter.

Kunmi: With the major and minor, would fifteen sustain you for four years or

will you have to be longer?

AnnRea: I have no idea yet.

Kunmi: Okay.

AnnRea: I think so. If anything, I can take summer classes.

Kunmi: Okay, alright, cool.

AnnRea: Is there anything else to say about 00:57:00 yourself?

Kunmi: About myself, yeah. Before we make this an interview about you. No,

really no. No, no. I think that's it for me.

AnnRea: Okay, this is AnnRea Fowler signing off.

[End of recording]