VT Stories Oral History with Emily Haynes Cooper, Tara Fortune, Jeryl Payne, and Kaye Pereras, April 22, 2016 (Ms2016-015)

David Cline: So, today is April 22, 2016. This is David Cline from the

History Department of Virginia Tech for the VT Stories Oral History Project. And

I've got some special guests with me today. So if you could introduce yourself

for the tape that would be wonderful.

Tara Fortune: Thanks. Tara Fortune. Place of birth is Arlington, Virginia, and

my major was psychology. And I graduated in [19]95.

Female: [Whispers] the year you were born.

Tara: The year I was born...1971. [Laughs].

David: I'm older.

Tara: [Laughs].

Jeryl Payne: I'm Jeryl Payne. The year of graduation was 1993 and 1996, and the

place of birth Washington, D.C.. And that's all, right?

Female: Nope. The year of your birth.

Jeryl: Year of birth 1971.

David: Fantastic.

Catherine Pereras: I'm Catherine Pereras. Place of birth was Canal Zone, Panama

in 1973. And my major here at Virginia Tech was health education with a

concentration in exercise science, and my graduation year was officially 1997.

David: [Laughs].

Emily Haynes Cooper: My name is Emily Haynes Cooper, and my place of birth is

Norfolk, Virginia in 1973. And my major here was health education--the sciences

track--and I graduated in 1995.

David: So, usually when I do an interview like this, I start by asking the

person to talk through their whole lives and we would eventually get to

[Virginia] Tech. But, I don't want to do that today. What I want to do is start

with 00:01:00how you all know each other. [Laughter]. So, I just want to jump right into it.

Catherine: That's a good story.

David: [Laughs].

Female: That is a really good story.

David: And if you could say your name first, again, if you remember to.

Catherine: I'm Catherine, and we at some point all lived in West AJ [Ambler

Johnston Hall] in the dorm. And in the school year of 1990-[19]9--that was my

freshman year--I lived diagonally from Ms. Jeryl Payne. And then somehow that

same school year at a party somewhere I met Tara, who lived also in West AJ

[Ambler Johnston Hall] but on the second floor, right?

Tara: Yes, second floor.

Catherine: Okay. And then you ended up, Tara, hosting a student for black

freshmen 00:02:00preview weekend which ended up being Emily.

Tara: Emily [Laughter].

Catherine: And Emily wasn't going to come to Virginia Tech at first. She really

believed she was going to Spelman [College], and after a weekend with the three

of us--[Laughter]

Emily: No, Jeryl wasn't there.

Jeryl: I wasn't here.

Catherine: Oh you weren't?

Jeryl: No.

Catherine: Okay. After the weekend with us and a few other people in the dorm,

she called us that next week and said she was coming the next school year to

Virginia Tech. So, when she came on board her freshman year and here we are.

Jeryl: Here we are.

David: That's fascinating.

Catherine: Now people have come and gone in our circle-

Jeryl: Yes, in our circle.

Catherine: But the four of us have stayed consistent.

David: And do you get together outside of here, regularly, anything like that, occasionally?

Jeryl: We do, occasionally. This is Jeryl. We try to do this 00:03:00yearly, but you

know life happens. But, we started good. We met regularly over the summers and

Emily and Kay lived in the same area. Tara and Jeryl, we live in the same area,

so we were able to stay connected that way. So now that we can't physically meet

on a regular basis now...what is the thing called?

Females: Google hangout. [Laughter]

Jeryl: We do a Google hangout. [Laughter]. You can see how well versed I am in

the Google hangout. [Laughter].

David: So, let's stay with you, Jeryl. If you could tell us a little bit, for

the record, about your growing up. So where you were born and about your

childhood and--I know we will go through that rather quickly--how you ended up

in Blacksburg at Virginia Tech.

Jeryl: Okay. Well it all started on a farm. [Laughter] 00:04:00No, I'm sorry.

David: I'll be back in a few minutes. [Laughter]

Jeryl: No, I was born in Washington, D.C. Both of my parents were born in

Washington, D.C., and so I grew up in Washington and Arlington, Virginia, and

Alexandria, Virginia all at the same time. And so when I went to high school, I

ended up at a high school in Washington, D.C. at a school called Duke Ellington

School of the Arts. I was very interested in music and other arts. And then, you

know, you have to take these PSAT exams. And then once you do that, people get a

little bit interested in you, and they start sending you things. And I received

a fee waiver from a school called Virginia Tech that I had never heard of

before. And so I was like, I think I like this school. It sounds like a good

place. And so then, like Emily, I came to 00:05:00the Black student weekend. And I had

never smelled a skunk before [Laughter]. Cow manure, maybe. But I was like, what

is this place? But then, when I came on the campus, I was like this is home. So,

I came, and I have been a Hokie for real, I mean, like ever since.

David: How much of this sort of feeling of home was due to that weekend and the

people that you met then?

Jeryl: That weekend was great, but it was like the campus that was-- You know,

the people were all right, but it wasn't that for me that weekend. The people

for me were like once they came, you know? But before that, I just fell in love

with the campus, and I just love the atmosphere of the school.

David: 00:06:00Can I ask you the same question?

Tara: Sure. Actually my story is quite similar to her as far as how I got here

with the fee waiver because I had never heard of Virginia Tech either.

David: And this is Tara by the way.

Tara: This is Tara. I was born in Arlington, Virginia and grew up in Fairfax

County, Virginia. Both my parents are from that area, as well. And like Jeryl, I

received in the mail a fee waive application to some school called Virginia

Tech. And I was like, free? Okay, I'll do it. And then I came down that same

weekend--probably the same time you were here-- and loved it. I just loved the

way the people treated me and they just kind of took me in and they welcomed me

and I was like, mom, this is where I want to go. That's how I ended up here. And

all my friends from high school also came here-

David: Oh, okay.

Tara: So that kind of helped with me as well. But then I met them and you know--

David: [Laughs].

Tara: Pretty 00:07:00much took off from there.

David: All right, thank you. Catherine?

Catherine: How did I get here? [Laughter]. So, I am a product of immigrants, you

know, and my father was in the U.S. Navy, hence why I was born in Panama because

there was a naval base down there at the time. And my parents just wanted me to

go to college. I didn't get a fee waiver-

Tara: Oh? Sorry.

Catherine: But I will say that my parents were the type that looked at the name

of schools, and we didn't get to tour because there was no--they just knew that

their best friend from their church group had a kid who went here as well, and

they said, Virginia Tech is a good school. She's now something in biology, and

that's a good school. So, I figured for 00:08:00me personally, Virginia Tech was still

in-state, but five hours away. [Laughter]. Where my parents could not pop up

because the other choice was Old Dominion university which was just thirty

minutes away. And so I came here, and when we came here that summer before my

freshman year, my parents even they fell in love with just the way that the

campus looked. And they said, you know, there's no way that you can potentially

get in trouble here [Laughter] because-

Tara: Whew!

Jeryl: Whoa!

Emily: Oh my!

Catherine: They just felt like it was a college town, and, you know, I was safe

here. That I was safe here.

Tara: You were safe.

Catherine: We had a good time. They enjoyed the fact that I came to this school,

so yes. That's how I ended up here. Now I have a daughter who's here.

David: Oh, you do?

Catherine: Yes.

David: Great.

Catherine: She's 00:09:00actually outside. So my daughter, I think, the four of us in

some way influenced her to come here as well because we've brought her here ever

since she was--to football games and to this type of reunion weekend. So, she

loves it here as a freshman.

David: And I would imagine growing up knowing this friend base that you would

want the same thing.

Catherine: Yes. Yeah, in her essay, I know when I previewed it, she said she

wanted that same type of bond. So, yes.

David: Emily?

Emily: All right. I also did not get a fee waiver-

Tara: [Laughs] We were the lucky ones.

Emily: But I am the youngest of four children born, too. My father is from

Virginia. My mother is actually from Harlem, New York. And I am the only child

and grandchild in my extended family who did not go to a historically black

college and 00:10:00university. But that was my plan as was said previously that I was

going to go to Spelman [College]. But, the way that I ended up at [Virginia]

Tech, I actually had been in gifted and talented programs and did a summer

program at NASA Langley [Research Center] and knew that I wanted to go to

medical school and never voiced that to my parents. They were actually very

surprised when I got accepted to medical school. That's kind of when they found

out I was applying. But, I did this program at NASA, and it was for engineering.

You know, they wanted to increase blacks in engineering, so I did that. And

that's when I knew that I did not want to be an engineer because that was the

most boring thing ever. [Laughter]. And my brother was in engineering school,

and he's a strange kid. Love him [Laughter]. But anyway. So, actually, my uncle

worked at NASA and so I'm applying at colleges, and they wanted to know I didn't

apply for the co-op program where you could work every other 00:11:00semester at NASA.

It's a full scholarship, and I'm like, because I want to go to med school. Can I

do biochemistry? They were like, no. You have to major in engineering. And I'm

like, eh. So, I applied to just four schools, got into all four. I did Spelman

[College] early decision, but Spellman wasn't trying to give me any money. And

I'm like, really? I'm in the top 5 percent of my class and you're not giving me

any money? That's an historical black college, so that was out because my

parents couldn't afford to send me to Georgia and pay for school. So, then there

was North Carolina A&T, another historical black college. But we visited there,

and we found out that they guaranteed housing for black men. But for the black

women, we had to go in a lottery program. So that's when my brother was in

school. So my mother says, well, so you mean to tell me if my daughter--you're

guaranteeing one in four--if my daughter doesn't get picked for the lottery and

say a young woman from Greensboro does, then that young woman gets the room? And

they are like, 00:12:00yes. And so she looks at me and says, you will have to live with

your brother. And I said, time to go. [Laughter]. So A&T was out, so then I was

left with NC State and Virginia Tech. I visited NC State, and it was a gloomy

rainy day. And I just kind of didn't like the campus, and I was like, eh. And I

visited NC State with a friend of mine, Shayna. We had been in school together

since kindergarten, and then she did not come to Virginia Tech black freshmen

weekend, but I did. And, of course, you already know I stayed with Tara that

weekend. I met them. Jeryl wasn't there, had a blast. It was really about two or

three weeks later that I called them back. And Shayna and I were sitting in

calculus one day and decision day was coming up and we were like, well what are

we going to do? And I'm like, I don't know. What do you want to do? And she's

like, I don't know. I said, well I really like [Virginia] Tech. I had a blast at

black freshmen weekend. I think we should go there. And she was like, okay. So I

was like, okay. So, we decided to 00:13:00come. That's how it happened, and I have not

regretted it, not for one second. Not just because of my friends, my crew, the

experience. So, definitely a decision that I do not regret. And I now have an

eight-month-old so I'm like, okay. We're going on your first college tour. This

is the only school that matters ever. [Laughter]. So we already started the

immersion plan for her.

David: [Laughs]. Can I ask you each about your first year here [and] what that

first year was like? The transition.

Tara: I'll go.

David: Yeah.

Tara: It was very hard because I had never been away from home. Four hours is

really not that far-

David: This is Tara by the way.

Tara: This is Tara, sorry. Tara. But I had never been away from my parents, so

that was very difficult for me. And I didn't want to stay. Why am I getting emotional?

Female: Aw.

Emily: Yeah. It was.

Tara: It was, but I 00:14:00stayed. My mom was like, there's no way in hell you're

coming back home. So I was like, okay. I don't have a choice then. And I stayed,

and I'm glad that I stayed.

David: So, can I ask you what it was that was making you think about leaving?

Tara: I think just not being with my family. Sorry. [Crying].

Catherine: This is Catherine. I think that when you get here, it's really hard

to find a situation where you have a family support. And you kind of have to

find that with people who live in your dorm, and there's not very many of us.

When I say us, there's not very many Black students, minority students. And then

at that, it's hard to be able to find people that you gel with. 00:15:00And so when you

find that, then you're very lucky and you'll stay. But that first year you're

already like, God. How do I get adjusted to the classes? Especially for all of

us, we were good students.

Female: Right.

Catherine: But back then--

Female: We were. Were being the opposite word.

Catherine: We were just talking about this earlier today where when you come

here as a freshman, you were in the top 5 percent of your high school class, but

you get a shock because back then they didn't train you.

Female: No.

Catherine: They didn't really give you the opportunity to say, okay when you go

to college, this is how you're going to have to study. And I know my girlfriends

very well, things came naturally for us. Like we could just go to class, read

something whatever. So freshman year, we had to work. I mean, work. And we

didn't do very well. I can tell you 00:16:00that. We did not do very well academically,

so that was a downer. But then the other piece was because then you're

disappointing your parents and then not having that family support here. So

trying to find yourself as well. I think that's the other piece. Is that when

you're that young I was--

Jeryl: Seventeen.

Emily: Seventeen.

Catherine: We were all Seventeen when we came to-

Tara: I was not. [Laughs]

Catherine: Even though she came one year after me, Emily, I was seventeen years

old coming to Virginia Tech. So I was trying to figure out who I was, you know.

I think you kind of just get homesick. Yeah. I can't believe you're crying and

you made me cry. [Laughter]. So, I think that is why your first year you do

struggle. And it's funny 00:17:00because my first year was not the same time as theirs-

Female: Right.

Catherine: Nor was it at the same time as Emily's, but I think we all went

through it.

Emily: And I can say--this is Emily--mine was a struggle in a different way

because I got the benefit of the experience of these guys because I came in and

it was like I was their baby. So, they made sure that I had that family support

from day one. So, I didn't have that part of the loneliness because I came in

with a ready-made family, and so I credit them with giving me the support that I

needed. My struggle was--I guess I didn't finish telling you that I did end up

taking that scholarship from NASA, even though I knew that I didn't want to be

an engineer, and got the first F in my life ever. Had never failed a grade. Had

never gotten a C, and so I was devastated. And I'm like, what do I do? I had

this scholarship, and even though I knew that it was great for my family because

my parents had paid for my sister to go to Hampton, which 00:18:00was at that time a

$13,000 a year school. They were helping my brother, the engineer at A&T. So,

they couldn't afford for me to come here, really, even though it was the second

cheapest school in the state. So, coming to grips with having to be realistic

and lose my scholarship. And I learned something. I learned the huge lesson that

I couldn't do things for money. That if I wasn't in it, that my heart wasn't in

it, I would not succeed. So, for me, it was that piece of the academics, and you

know, engineering here is definitely a weeding out process your first year. If

you do not want to be an engineer, you will get weeded out. So, that was just a

little bit of the difference for me, but I was also very happy to be five hours

away from my parents. But I came into a ready-made family, so kind of that

loneliness and stuff, I didn't have that part because I had them. And I had

Shayna, who was my roommate who I had known since 00:19:00kindergarten. So I came into a

ready-made family.

Jeryl: This is Jeryl by the way. I came with a roommate that I kind of knew, but

as it turns out, she was crazy [Laughter]. And so a month in, we realized this

wasn't going to work out. So she moved out, so I had the benefit--and I'm an

only child--so when she moved out, then it was more comfortable for me because I

was used to being by myself all the time. But it was hard because I knew a lot

of people because of a program that they had set up for Black freshmen where you

had a mentor and you had a small group of people that you met with regularly.

But those weren't my friends. They helped me to survive and maintain. And I

hadn't met Tara yet. Kay wasn't here yet. Emily wasn't here yet. 00:20:00So, the people

that are your family are the people that live right in the rooms right near you.

And so I went to dinner with those people. We went out together sometime. But it

was like, okay see you tomorrow. I didn't have to see them ever again if need

be. But that first year was like that, and then my second year I'm glad that I

stayed in the same dorm because then that's when I met Kay who lived catty

corner to me. And so, you know, right away we clicked, and her roommate as well,

we clicked. And so the second year was really the best. That felt like my first

year because the first year I was just here and maintaining. And then when we

all met, then it was school, even though I also failed [Laughter] my first class ever.

Female: I think maybe we 00:21:00all did.

Jeryl: Yeah, we all failed at least one class.

Female: Yeah, at least one.

Jeryl: Together, though, we made it.

Female: We really did.

Jeryl: So it was hard.

David: You mentioned that program that was there to assist freshmen, so that was

some help. But what other kinds of support or social outlets or organizations

were there that helped you sort of get by or find your people?

Jeryl: I don't know if there was an organization, but there was a student who

was...there were a few students who were seniors, and there was one in

particular. His name was Kwame Alexander when I was a freshman. Now, he's a

Newberry author, an award-winning author.

Female: She had to put that in there [Laughs].

Jeryl: I did. So he would have these black study groups. So the academic

buildings were 00:22:00open at night, and so he would just say, we're going to be in

this building, in this room, and we're going to learn the geography of Africa.

Or, we're going to learn about kings and queens. Whatever it was going to be.

And I was so amazed, and like many people not learning Black history until I

came to college. And it was just so amazing to me, and I just loved that

learning and just the history of it all. And so I migrated to those people. And

they were much older than me, so, of course, they weren't hanging out with me.

But at that time, I could be with them. I could be a part of a group. But the

mentoring programs, I don't know if anyone has talked about Glenn Valentine.

David: Unh-uh. No.

Jeryl: So, I don't know what his job was.

Female: I don't either.

Jeryl: I don't know what this man's job was, but he's very 00:23:00famous at this school

for bringing Black students here.

Female: In the [19]80s and early [19]90s.

Jeryl: He was the [19]90s and then-

Female: Calvin Jamison.

Jeryl: Calvin Jamison was the-

Female: [19]70s and [19]80s.

Jeryl: He worked in the admissions office. That's what he did. He worked in the

admissions office. But he, like, made it his job to get Black students here and

to keep Black students here. And just having that person that met my mother in

the admissions office that I knew I could always go and talk to, that was very,

very helpful to me, just having an adult that I could connect to if I needed

some help. So that was good.

David: Did he play a role like for all of you, or for some of you?

Emily: Um-hm. This is Emily. When I came in, it definitely was Glenn Valentine,

and that was the group that she mentioned where you had a mentor and you met

with your group. But also for me, there was also a NSBE, the National Society of

Black Engineers, because at the time I 00:24:00was an engineering major. So, I met

people through that. They had, I want to say, it was like monthly meetings, and

I went. And even though I didn't end up being an engineer, I still had

relationships with those people. So that was one of the organizations, early,

the two that were helpful for me.

Female: FASA [Filipino American Student Association], Kay...

Catherine: Yeah, first year. Yeah, FASA.

Female: And who are you?

Catherine: Oh, Catherine Kay Pereras.[Laughter]. Yeah, FASA my first year. And

then the first year, I used to go to the Newman Community, Catholic Community.

Yeah, I used to go all the time.

Female: Praise the Lord.

Catherine: I volunteered there to do babysitting. So, for me it was just trying

to connect with something from home, my faith, being a catholic, and then also

being Philippine American, just trying to still have that sense. But I 00:25:00think the

other piece socially was just being in the dorm, for me. You know, I reflect,

and I think that a lot of connections that I made with not even just this group

of women was through TV night. [Laughter]. To lighten up the mood real quick-

Female: Thank you.

David: Um-hm.

Catherine: [Laughter]. If it wasn't for TV night on a Thursday night, and the

only reason why I say I can actually reflect on this because I just had an

experience where this past weekend where Thursday night TV was the Cosby show,

was A Different World. Was...what else did we watch?

Emily: Eventually Living Single.

Catherine: So, you know, and it was that kind of going through whatever the

characters were going through on TV, especially A Different World, you know we

kind of saw that. And then it 00:26:00turned into Martin, Living Single, New York

Undercover, and it was these TV shows that you know you kind of escaped from it,

from whatever was going on. All of us would just get together in the TV lounges,

and I mean there were a lot of us. We packed up the West AJ [Ambler Johnston

Hall] TV lounges just getting together on Thursday nights. And so those were the

kind of things that I believe we bonded over TV. The TV shows I think really

connected, not even just Black, Filipino, whatever. It was just that was the thing.

Female: People on your floor, people on the floor downstairs.

Jeryl: And music videos.

Female: Yes.

Yes: That's right.

Emily: Yes, the music video era.

Catherine: I think that we always made sure that we had dinner time and then we

had our TV connections that one time of the week, you 00:27:00know, it was important to

us, and that's how we had our outlet. So that was fun. So yeah. What else?

David: Can I ask about the challenges of being at a majority white institution?

Jeryl: How much time do we have? [Laughter].

David: I just give you the easy ones.

Catherine: So this is funny. This is Kay [Catherine]. We, now being...how long

has it been? Twenty-four or twenty-five years since we've been here?

Tara: Something like that.

Catherine: When we were here we saw some pretty historical things that actually

happened while we were in Blacksburg. I will never get the KKK.

Female: The KKK rally, um-hm.

Catherine: Walking through....was it Main Street?

Female: Main Street.

Catherine: Walking down Main Street. I was like, I thought that that was just TV

stuff. Like, really? That happens?

Female: No, not TV 00:28:00 stuff.

Catherine: We had the...What was it? No Justice, No Peace? Rodney King.

Female: Yes, Rodney King.

Female: Oh, yeah. OJ [Simpson].

Catherine: We had the Rodney King rallies. I mean, we were here during that

time. We did a rally where it was a Rodney King No Justice No Peace.

Female: Yeah, No Justice No Peace.

Jeryl: We sat in Arnold's and watched the whole thing with OJ [Simpson].

Catherine: Yes, it just unfolded-

David: Going down the road.

Jeryl: Yeah, absolutely. We were in there.

Catherine: In front of us. So it's crazy because now when you look at those

things on TV, it kind of hasn't changed. You know, there is still some things

that, now, going to a predominantly white institution, I think minority students

still have to be careful of their race is still something. Gender is still an

issue, you know. Your sexual 00:29:00preference, that's more prevalent than race and

gender back then. But, you know, whatever it was for us it was Rodney King and

OJ. Now it's the Michael Brown situation. So certain things that have happened,

and it didn't necessarily happen in Virginia or whatever, but it impacted us as

people. And so it's like, what are you going to do about it? What did we want to

do about it? How are we going to be better? And we did have some stuff that

actually happened during our time here that impacted who we were. Yeah, I still

can't believe that KKK and you know. I can't believe it just seeing, I mean it

was massive going down Main Street.

David: How did the campus--whatever that means-- respond 00:30:00to something that like?

Jeryl: There were two camps, as far as I could see. Some people were like, this

is not going to happen, and we're going to go out to Main Street and protest.

And then there was, stay in your dorms-

Female: Lock yourself in.

Jeryl: And wait until it's finished.

Female: Right.

Jeryl: So, you know, you had to make a decision. And if your parents knew about

it, of course your parents helped you to make that decision. [Laughter]. But it

was just crazy like Kay said. Oh and this is Jeryl by the way. It was crazy

because I'm like, what? Really? And I was terrified. And even though you come to

a small town like this and there's blatant racism all the time, you still are

like, well wait a minute. This is serious because you know you've seen on TV

crosses burning and you're like, wait a minute.

Female: You think it's just TV.

Jeryl: Yeah, I mean but that was like on a large scale. But on any given 00:31:00 Friday,

we could be at a party. Same kind of thing would happen with the local police,

you know, where they are terrorizing young Black men and young Black women for

just standing together or whatever. And so, it was, I don't know. It was an

interesting time like Kay said. It's just amazing. But, I mean, this town and

this area you know you can't get away from it, you can't. And you have to come

here and know who you are enough to be able to deal with it because if not,

you're going to be a victim of it.

Emily: This is Emily. It's definitely disappointing for me because even though

among the four of us, I think we all agree that Jeryl is super Hokie. But I

love...[Laughter]. She really is, marching Virginians, everything, she's super Hokie.

Jeryl: 330 strong! Aay! 00:32:00[Clapping]. I'm sorry.

Emily: That was Jeryl interrupting me. [Laughs]. So, but you know, we all love

our school, and I definitely love [Virginia] Tech. And I always talk about it. I

always talk to my patients, young people, about coming to [Virginia] Tech. And

it's hard, you know, when you have someone who asks you well how many Black

students go to [Virginia] Tech? Well how many were there when you were there?

And I'm still saying that we are less than 5 percent of over 20,000 students,

how can I really talk somebody into sending their kid here? Let's not even begin

to talk about all the things that have happened in the last decade.

Female: Right. Oh my God, yeah.

Emily: Not even counting that. But, it hasn't changed, and that is very, very

disappointing. But, I look at myself like, okay, what can I as an alumni do? And

it's hard to really affect much change kind of outside of the bubble. If you are

not connected and on boards and talking to the right people, how can you really

affect that change? And so that's something that still weighs on me because yes,

I 00:33:00think the school--and I'm going to go on and say it--that the school needs to

do a better job of creating a place where it really is truly diverse. And I

don't think they've done that yet at all, at all.

Catherine: Well yeah, they haven't. This is Kay. They have not. I mean 5

percent? That's ridiculous.

Female: It's 4.9, isn't it?

Emily: It's 4.5, right? Not counting-

Jeryl: With people who are mixed race and black.

Emily: Right.

Catherine: It was less than 3 percent for just black students is what Dr. Clark

said. 3 percent.

David: Oh, wow.

Catherine: But when you combined it with biracial or two or more, that ended up

getting it closer to five, so that still doesn't look good. It is difficult, I

think. You know, it's difficult.

Jeryl: But we are--and this is Jeryl--always happy when we get one in because,

you know, I may be a little fanatical about the school.

Female: A little? [Laughter]

Jeryl: 00:34:00And I'm a teacher, and so I am able to impact hundreds of children, you

know, or bully hundreds of children, into making this their first choice school.

So you know, they get pens, pencils, they look at a banner, Hokie bird. They

know all of that, but when we are able to impact someone to get them to come

here, even despite you know what happened in 2007, despite what happened, all of

these that have happened, you know, we are overjoyed when we can get one to

come. So like for Kay's daughter to want to come here, that was like amazing for

all of us. Now we have a daughter here. She's the 00:35:00 legacy.

David: I love that you say, we have a daughter.

Female: Well, she's all of our child.

Female: Yes.

Jeryl: Yes.

David: I picked that up when you talked about her earlier.

Jeryl: She knows. She has big shoes to fill, and she's doing a great job so far,

so good job Mom.

Catherine: Thanks.

Female: Yep.

Catherine: I couldn't have done it without you. So yes.

Emily: I guess I'm the baby daddy. This is Emily.

Jeryl: Yikes. [Laughs]. How does that work? [Laughs].

Catherine: But I mean, David--this is Kay--despite everything socially that

happened, we graduated-

Jeryl: Yes

Catherine: I will tell you that that for each one of us is a very proud moment

for all of us to make it through and to be able to tell people we are Hokie

alumni and we are very proud. We are very 00:36:00proud. I think that we can all say

this, we would not trade the experiences that we had here for the world. We

lived the years that we had...[Laughter].

Jeryl: I mean no regrets, no.

Catherine: We took advantage of every moment, we really did. We took advantage.

We tried to do the best that we could.

Tara: But we did it together.

Catherine: Yeah.

David: Just going back for a second to where [Virginia] Tech is now and where

[Virginia] Tech's at, what do you think [Virginia] Tech can do, should do

better? I know that's huge but...

Emily: This is Emily. First of all, they have to be active and vocal. For

example, the gentleman who just came that was sponsored by Pamplin College of

Business, you know. Once you found out that this man has written things

espousing his 00:37:00hate to still support him coming, what does that say to the Black

students and to other multicultural students? It says on paper we say we care,

but really we don't.

Female: We really don't, right.

Emily: So you have to put the action behind the words. And the're not doing

that. So, I think bringing the new...what is she? Vice President for diversity

is a start, but you have to get the right person because maybe previously there

wasn't the right person in that position. But they have to make a commitment and

put their money where their mouths are because there's still a problem with

scholarship funds. Like, I was very shocked. My daughter's daycare teacher, you

know, I told her that Dylan wasn't coming to daycare today because we were

coming up here, and she is like, oh you know a little girl from my church is

probably going there. She got accepted in multiple places, but that's the place

that gave her the most money. I almost passed out.

Female: [Virginia] Tech gave her the most money?

Emily: Yes!

Female: Wow.

Emily: Because typically the story is [Virginia] Tech has 00:38:00given our students the

least because we're a state school. We don't have Special Funds. We have to

figure this out. So, I was very shocked about that, so I'm interested. She's

supposed to announce at her church on Sunday so on Monday I will be like, so

what did she decide? Is she going? And I was like, if she's going, tell her to

call me. I want to meet her. So because again, I feel like that's a win when we

can get someone here. But then once we send our children here, you better

freaking take care of them. You know, they shouldn't be feeling like they're

alone. They don't have people to talk to. So more visibility and allowing the

faculty and the student programs that we have to connect with our babies because

you're sending your child away. And for many people, you know, like we've all

said, Blacksburg was the furthest place we could go and still be in the state.

Female: That's it.

Emily: So there is no, my mamma can get up at ten and see my face by twelve

noon, you know. It's a planned trip. So, they've got to put action behind what

they claim they're doing, and I haven't seen 00:39:00action yet. And I was on the

Multicultural Alumni Advisory Board, and it was a whole lot of meetings and a

whole lot of talking and a whole bunch of nothing going on. I've been behind the

scenes, so I can say I know that it's a lot of talk, but no action behind it.

Jeryl: I do think that the piece--this is Jeryl--the piece with connecting

alumni with students is a huge piece and for parents to feel like their kids are

in a safe place. I can only reference what I've seen at historically black

schools, particularly Morehouse [College], they have like a rites of passage

where the parents and the kids come together, and they tell the parents we're

going to take care of these boys. And the parents sign this document, you know,

I'm going to make sure to do my part. They're going to make sure to do their

part. They put it in this box. They will get it back in four years to 00:40:00say, and

it's a whole program that you understand that they are going to be nurtured

here. And even in a large campus setting, we were able to find a small family.

You can do it. So however they have to do it, connecting the alumni with the

students and making the parents feel a part of the process. I think that would

be one way to get more diversity here because diversity for one group is

different than it is for another group. And so that is really the conversation

that needs to be had is, how can we nurture different groups for them to feel

like they are welcome here? So, I think that's something...

Catherine: I think--this is 00:41:00Kay--now being a parent, I think what I would like

to see is a more diverse faculty.

David: I was just going to ask that question. Thank you.

Catherine: To recruit for diverse faculty because the thing is is when my

daughter--and I tell her, hey you need to go up to the advisory thing. It's like

she's trying to explain to me, and I said, well what do you mean they just don't

understand? She did have, when she first came here this fall semester, she did

have a Black advisor. And then for whatever reason, I guess he transferred to

another school or something like that, and she was like, we talked about

everything. You know, and then now coming into this spring semester when she's

trying to choose her classes for the fall, she was like, I don't know, Mom. I'm

trying to talk to them. They don't understand. I don't really have anybody to

talk to. It's a very different experience from when she was here summer and fall

to now. I said, 00:42:00well then go up the chain. You know me. I'm always like, well

then go up the chain. What about the lady who's your department head that we met

this summer. She said she will take care of it if your advisor couldn't. Go talk

to her. But still, it's the connection that the students have to have. It's a

must, and for me and Emily when we were in the College of Education, health

education--Dr. [Kerry] Redican, he really did connect with us. He really did get

to know who we were, and he embraced who we were. He embraced our struggles

because we both have the same stories. We didn't do well in our freshman year,

and he helped us blossom in our last two and a half years. If it wasn't for him,

I think we wouldn't have been able to say, here's our degree. So I think that

the university does have to recruit for a diverse faculty, but one 00:43:00with open

minds, to be able to...The question should be, well how are you as a member of

this faculty and staff going to affect the students here? That should be the

question. What can you do? We live by the motto, so that should be the same

thing I hope for the faculty. The other piece, is now also being a parent, is

Emily's right. The scholarships piece, you know. I'm struggling to make sure

Arianna is here, but she wanted to come here. And it's different because her

senior year, she got a full ride to Norfolk State University, Old Dominion

University. She didn't want to stay local. Even out of state East Carolina

University offered her a thing, and Virginia Tech didn't offer her anything. And

she had a 3.98 00:44:00GPA. So it was like what else can she do? You take a look at

that, and you say, well what are you doing for the minority students to get them

here? Because at the end of the day, as a single mom how are you supposed to pay

for college? When I told them how much college was, I said, you all it's like

$22,000. They're like, what? We only paid what-

Female: Six [thousand].

Catherine: Six to eight thousand.

Emily: $24,000 for the whole time.

Catherine: And so I'm telling them, college is different now where $24,000 a

year...it's crazy. twenty-two to twenty-four thousand. I said you know what, the

funny thing is it's no different than JMU or UVA, and those universities offered

something and my own alma mater didn't offer anything. And it's not like I

didn't give money back to the school. They got some 00:45:00money. You know what little

I had, Rick and I gave Virginia Tech. Let me say this, sorry for the record, I

don't give money [Laughs]. I do it because I love this school, but I wonder how

many people when they finally have their children come up, how does that make

you as an alumni feel that you've done what you could, but then yet your kin get nothing.

Female: Right.

Catherine: It doesn't mean anything.

Female: It's like a slap in the face.

Female: It is.

Catherine: And so you're like, okay. And the funny thing is is even when I

shared it with them--we talk about the people who graduated around our time--and

I remember coming to the last Black alumni reunion we brought Arianna here for

her junior year, and I remember people telling me, our kid couldn't even get in.

They didn't even get accepted into Virginia 00:46:00Tech. I was like...and they are all

like 3.8, 3.9 [GPA] and their own children couldn't get in. And I said, oh okay.

Arianna you've got a lot of work to do. And she was one of the few that was

accepted. I remember coming here this past summer and they said this was the

smartest class. I think this freshman was, what did I tell y'all, 3.9?

Female: 3.9 something.

Catherine: Was the GPA. Was the average of the freshman.

David: Average high school GPA?

Catherine: Me and her looked at each other, you know, wow honey, okay. You are

in good company. I think that the university does have to take a look at it. I

mean, I don't know what the right formula is, but I think it just needs to

consider the make-up of the person. I don't know how scholarships are

determined. I do know financial aid has changed from when we were here, but

there has to be opportunity. I think that if you can give 00:47:00somebody that

opportunity then it opens the doors. And if you don't give somebody the

opportunity, you can't impact anybody. So that's all I have. [Laughs].

David: I appreciate you saying it. No, I really do.

Catherine: What else is on your list?

David: Oh I got more.

Female: A ton.

David: I was thinking about the faculty thing, too.

Female: Yeah, that's huge.

David: It's tough. There's a small program that has been around to foster and

recruit young faculty of color and get them here. So, I'm in the history

department, and I'm a proud graduate of UNC. And there is a guy a couple of

years behind me, and we went and talked to him about if he would be interested

in coming in here. He came up through that program and we hired him, and now

he's leaving after two years.

Female: 00:48:00That's the key. People use [Virginia] Tech as a stepping stone. And

that's not good.

David: And I don't blame him for a second, but it's like there's not a lot of

other people that look like him.

Female: Yeah. What can they do to keep him here?

David: He wants to have a family, and he can't find anyone to date.

Female: It's hard in the area, yeah. It's hard.

David: So, it's like I don't know the solution to that problem.

Female: It is hard.

Female: It is tough.

Jeryl: But it's a commitment to come here as a faculty member. There's nothing

like you nearby here unless you come from a farming community or a small town. I

love it here, and I would live here. But no one would come and visit me. I just-

Female: We'll go for the games.

Jeryl: See, and then people just want to stay here for the games.

David: You're hurting man, you don't lose [49:56]. [Laughs].

Jeryl: For 00:49:00me, it's hard when all of these people come to become faculty members

just for a minute for the name recognition of the school so they can go to

bigger and better things somewhere else. And I know you can't make people stay.

I know people want to grow, but it really affects the kids. Like, I think there

should be a time commitment, just like a high school counselor follows their

kids all the way through to their senior year. I think that there should be a

connection where you say, I'm going to be committed to this institution for a

certain amount of time, so that these kids can have somebody. So that Arianna is

not like that person has gone on, and now this person who knows how long she's

going to have this, you know? People need to know that there's somebody that's

always going to be there for them, and even if always is only going to be as

long as they're there, great. Just some kind of time commitment because all of

us have had different faculty members that we 00:50:00were close with at some time. It's

sad when they leave because you're like oh my God. What are we going to do? I

have to equate this to football for a minute like you know? I'm sure this new

Mr. [Coach] Fuente man is going to do a lovely job, but the only coach I know is

Frank Beamer. So change is hard, but Frank Beamer was committed to this school,

and now it's like in football coaches, if they're not winning you have to go.

And now that whole football team has to get to know somebody else. It's the same

with your college career, with any school career. People have to be committed to

you, and you have to be committed for yourself.

David: So, we've talked mostly about [Virginia] Tech, obviously, but can you

each tell me a little bit about your life since [Virginia] Tech, your careers?

And you connect it to [Virginia] Tech if [Virginia] Tech has played a 00:51:00role in

any particular way in that. Whoever wants to go first.

Emily: Okay. They are saying that. Why should I go first? [52:09]

Catherine: Emily has the success story, and Jeryl has a very good success story.

Jeryl: Kay, we all have a good success story. What are you talking about?

Catherine: No, as far as your career. I mean, I think you guys have good success stories.

Jeryl: And so do you. We can argue about this all day.

Emily: Before we go there, I just want to make sure that this is in the stories

because we heard about it in the session we were just in, the Donning of the

Kente. I need to put this story in there.

David: Oh, please.

Emily: That began...wasn't it [19]95? Spring of [19]95.

Female: [19]95.

Emily: And Dr. Prendergast was the...wasn't she the provost then or assistant

provost or something?

Jeryl: Something like that.

Emily: So that started in the spring of [19]95 with the graduates, and that

ceremony was where you parents would come. We wore our caps and gowns--well

maybe not your cap--but they would 00:52:00put the Kente cloth around you, and that was

the rite of passage that was started in our time. Your parents got to say

whatever they wanted to say about you, so that was great. It was started in May.

Well, I graduated in December, and this is not a story that's put out there. And

it's okay because I'm putting it in our oral history.

Female: It's out there now.

Emily: I'm putting it out there now. So, what happened, you know, I had gone to

my friend's Donning of the Kente ceremony in May. It was great, whatever. So I'm

getting ready for graduation in December, and you know I go to Dr. Prendergast

and I say, so, I haven't seen anything about the schedule for the Donning of the

Kente for the December graduates. She says, well we're not having it. And I

said, well why not? And she says, well, there are not enough graduates for it to

be meaningful. And I didn't feel that that was coming from her. I really felt

that it was coming from on high. And I said, well who do I need to talk to

because just because I graduate in December doesn't mean it's any less

meaningful for 00:53:00me than someone graduating in May. And we are going to have this

Donning of the Kente. [Laughter]. So, she was like, okay, well let me make some

calls. And so we ended up having the Donning of the Kente in December, and they

have done it in May and December ever since. But you know it's so funny, when

she met my mother she said, your daughter is something, and she made sure we had

this. And Dr. Prendergast has remembered me all that time. She's just like,

you're something. So anyway, I needed to make sure that was in the stories

because they were talking about that today, and I'm sure that these children

don't know that I was instrumental in helping to carry that forward.

Jeryl: And that's how she's been scribed, yes. Then end. [Laughter].

Emily: So I left Virginia Tech, and as I mentioned before, I hadn't really

voiced to my parents that I wanted to go to med school. My friends knew, and

they were very supportive. But, I knew that with my mishap as a freshman, even

though I 00:54:00had done very, very well the last two and a half years of school that I

probably couldn't get in medical school. So, I wasn't sure who to talk to, what

to do. So I graduated from [Virginia] Tech, went home and just started working

to try to figure out what I would do. I eventually got a job with a health

system back home and started talking to the doctors there like, I really want to

go to med school. What can I do, what can I do? So, this is how I got my

clinical shadowing experience because I was at work, and I would finish what I

had to do for work very quickly. And I would go around with them at lunch. So, I

then decided, okay I can do this med school thing. I decided to go back to ODU

and get a master's degree. And of course I applied to ODU. I knew that I could

just call [Virginia] Tech and come back here if I needed to, but because I was

already in the Tidewater area, I said well I'll see if I can get into ODU. And

if not, then I'll go to [Virginia] Tech. I did get in at ODU, got a master's

degree in 00:55:00biology. Applied to medical school, got in, had six interviews. I

applied at ten schools, got six interviews, and I got three acceptances. I ended

at Virginia Commonwealth University School of Medicine. Decided that I felt that

what my dream was was to be a medical director of an underserved community

clinic, and VCU started this combined degree program with a master's in health

administration. So all I had to do was stay an extra year and I could get both

degrees. So I decided to do that and graduated from there in 2006. I did

residency training in family medicine at Carolina Medical Center in Charlotte

and finished that in [20]09 and working as a family doctor. So I now live in

Charlotte, again. Oh, and I'm married and have an eight month old, I guess if

you want to know the personal stuff.

Tara: I 00:56:00know. I'm just going to sit over here, and y'all go ahead and talk

because I got nothing [Laughs].

Catherine: Tara, you have done-

Jeryl: Go ahead Kay, since they're...Go ahead.

David: You can tell each other's story too.

Catherine: What are we talking about?

Tara: Tell your story-

Jeryl: Tell your success.

Catherine: My success?

Jeryl: No, your life from [Virginia] Tech. Come on, Kay.

Catherine: Oh, life after graduating?

Female: Yeah.

Catherine: After I graduated, I just went home and found a job. It was nothing

related to my major. And then I got pregnant with Arianna, my daughter. And then

after that, I was like what do I want to do because what I really wanted to do

at that time was thinking I wanted to be some sort of physical therapist, but to

go postgraduate school with a daughter, that was kind of hard. So, instead I

went to Old Dominion and I got another degree in marketing which, you know, it's

so funny because in hindsight I'm like wow this business marketing degree, you 00:57:00know, I like it. It taps into a little bit of creativity and somehow today I'm a

business analyst. I mean, between marketing, I've been in sales jobs, been a

sales manager at the Virginian Pilot in Norfolk. And I think that my experiences

here at Virginia Tech and learning people but in different populations, it

helped me to be a successful salesperson and manager just because, you know, you

had to learn how to talk to different people. In order for you to get things

done, you had to know how to address who you were catering. You know especially

in sales, you couldn't get people to move unless you had a relationship with

them, and part of it was how to talk to people. I think that if I 00:58:00didn't have

the opportunity to kind of work with or socialize with the different populations

here, I don't think that I could have been successful in sales or even as a

manager. You know, today I'm a business analyst, and even still--I would tell

you the other thing that Virginia Tech does help you is kind of critical

thinking. They kind of challenge you. Even though they don't tell you outright

that this is what they're trying to do. They don't tell you that. And it's kind

of indirectly it happens just because they're pushing you to think, and you are

like, golly day what else can I do? You know, whether it was a paper or a

project or something like that, they really did push you in that critical

thinking. And I think that was a byproduct of coming here 00:59:00and the academic kind

of program that they gave you. So, you know, pushing people to work together and

definitely that critical thinking. And always asking questions. I don't know why

it was always in that, but I think that that's how Virginia Tech did help me as

far as what I do today. I think that that has helped. Both of these girls over

here, Jeryl and Tara, they came back to school here. I remember Jeryl left and

then came back for grad school.

Jeryl: I did. Thank you Kay. [Laughter].

Catherine: So Jeryl?

Jeryl: Thank you, Kay. This is Jeryl. [Laughter].

David: It's like The View, a talk show host.

Jeryl: So, I had decided that I only wanted degrees from [Virginia] Tech. I

decided that early 01:00:00on. And so I came back and my master's in education and then

I became a teacher. And then as a teacher you have to be recertified. They were

offering a group, a cohort group, and I have to get recertified. The school was

[Virginia] Tech. Here we go. I can get another degree from [Virginia] Tech. So,

I just try to stay with that, and now I'm still teaching. I have taught many

grades. I had the opportunity to teach overseas in South Korea, and from that I

met lots of people. I can have more opportunities if need be but I came back

home. But [Virginia] Tech has always been, you know, woven through my travel

experiences. [Sound of something moving in background].

Female: What was that?

Emily: He's pushing something.

Jeryl: Oh, gosh. [Laughter]. I was in the marching band, so that was always a

connection for me. I could always come back for 01:01:00alumni band weekend.

David: What's your instrument?

Jeryl: Clarinet. Did you laugh at me because I played Clarinet? Because we can

go back and forth.

Tara: No. He looked at you, and he was like what instrument? Like he wanted you

to say tuba. [Laughter].

David: Is that what I looked like?

Tara: He wanted something like, I want to hear something impressive.

David: No, I'm good with the clarinet.

Jeryl: It's impressive.

David: Clarinet is...Yeah.

Jeryl: Thank you very much. [Laughter].

David: I'm pro-Clarinet.

Jeryl: What I was going to say before I was rudely interrupted is that the band

director, Dave McKee, I greatly credit him for keeping me connected to

[Virginia] Tech. He's definitely one of the reasons I love [Virginia] Tech. And

what's amazing is, he has been a professor here for, I don't know, thirty-five

years maybe. He graduated from here, and he can remember every person's 01:02:00name who

has ever been in the band. And so I can call him, and we can talk like no time

has passed. And, you know, 330 children a year, this man is still able to keep

these connections. And so, you know, I never wanted to not be connected to

[Virginia] Tech and he was instrumental in that as well as other professors, of

course. But that was where I'm a teacher, but I'm also a [Virginia] Tech

advocate heavily. That's my job.

Tara: Definitely heavily.

Jeryl: Tara is also in the education field. Tara?

Catherine: Tara your degree was in? This is Kay.

Tara: This is Tara. My first degree is psychology, and then I came back and got

another degree in human services. And I am now a 01:03:00principal's administrative

assistant for a middle school, so that's why she says I'm in education.

Jeryl: But her life dream, I believe she is going to--and this is Jeryl-- is to

do some kind of counseling because she's always been that. Like she's always

interested in that, helping, working, something with counseling.

Tara: And I'm actually three classes away from getting my master's in human services-

David: Fantastic.

Tara: So it's just very, very expensive.

Emily: And we are eagerly awaiting coming to her graduation. This is Emily.

Tara: And it's not from [Virginia] Tech. Sorry.

David: [Laughs].

Jeryl: That's okay. There are other schools.

Tara: Yes, there's other schools. But, yes. Three classes away from getting it.

Jeryl: And she'll do it.

David: Fantastic.

Tara: As soon as each of them can contribute the money, done. Two thousand each.

Six thousand support.

Female: We're offering support.

Jeryl: We can only offer support.

Tara: Oh, not financial support?

Jeryl: Never.

Female: You can have 01:04:00Dylan and she'll give you something.

Tara: Okay. I tried.

David: It's on record. [Laughs].

Tara: Exactly, it's on record. [Laughs].

David: We covered a lot. I think we did a good job. [Laughs].

Jeryl: This was like a therapy session.

Female: It was very therapeutic. So thanks. For free.

David: Yeah, right? Well let me ask if there was something that I should have

asked or something that I didn't ask or you were expecting me to ask or

something that you wanted me to ask.

Female: A lot was covered.

Jeryl: Indirectly or directly, yes, everything that needed to be asked. And we

are talkers, so it's easy. Even if you didn't ask us we will tell you.

Female: It's like I went on record. It's part of history now.

Catherine: Can I just say one last thing? This is Kay.

David: Please.

Catherine: The only thing that I would like to see 01:05:00is, I mentioned at the

beginning that there have been other people who have been part of this circle.

And sometimes we saw people who were not necessarily, like Shayna, your first

roommate graduated. You know I want to see Virginia Tech do a better job of

retaining the minority students. I just want to go on record in saying that

because again, if the other minority students that we were friends with didn't

have or couldn't find that same thing that we found, it was hard. They left. I

brought my photo album and scrapbook and we were like what happened to her? And

there were a few people who, you know, after freshman or sophomore year left

because they couldn't either one, handle it academically, or two, they just

missed home so much and couldn't make that connection. 01:06:00And, you know, I think

that the reason why there are minority students just seeing now being a parent

and looking in, when you see people who do go to HBCUs, the one thing that they

do get is that family, that niche family thing. And that's the reason why for

minority students that's why they do--you know I've seen it--that's why they do

go to either a smaller institution or an HBCU. And so I just would like to see

Virginia Tech do more about trying to retain people, more than just this Black

alumni reunion weekend twice a year. I would like to see something because like

I said, it's that retention piece that nobody really talks about. So that's it.

I don't you didn't ask about that.

David: No, I appreciate it, especially actually because I was interviewing a 01:07:00couple of Black males alumni earlier, and they sort of brought it up. But we

didn't end up going into it in much depth, but it seems like this was a major

story, actually.

Jeryl: Oh it is. You know when we were here, the push was to get people to come,

but they didn't have something in place to get people to stay. And you know,

like this was at that time people thought was an easy school to get into, but a

hard place to stay while UVA was hard to get into, but was easy to stay.

Female: Yeah. That's what I was going to say.

Jeryl: You know, all schools had that opportunity of creating that family

environment. And even some predominantly white schools do a good job and they

are able to retain their minority--I don't like to say minority--but their

population of multicultural students. So there's a 01:08:00way. You know, [Virginia]

Tech has got to figure that out.

Catherine: Because then I think that that percentage--this is Kay--the

percentage could be better than 5 percent if you would just retain. Because it's

like you bring people in every year but it's just they fall out every year as

well. And so there is a retention problem, and I will tell you that it's not

just for us women, but what I witnessed when I was here was Black men. It was

the friends that we had, I think sometimes they might have missed their family a

lot more. And to be a man I don't think that they could express that. And so

that's why when you say it's interesting that the men that you interviewed

earlier, I think that because you're supposed to be a strong man and whatever,

they couldn't express that. But whereas we as women, we found that strength, so

I would love to see that. There 01:09:00is a story there that people could tell, obviously.

David: That's important. Thank you for saying that. And thank you to all of you.

This was wonderful and important.

Female: Okay. Well thank you.

Female: Looking for my royalties. [Laughter].

[End of Interview]